Ahead on all three judges’ scorecards at the time, heavyweight Carlos Takam is outraged at what he believes was a premature stoppage by referee Steve Gray in Saturday’s clash with Joe Joyce.
Takam stated, “Joe Joyce was punching at me yes, but I see that he was getting really tired, so I tried to keep my hands up, that was my strategy, to come back after he was tired and put him out. He stopped the fight and I ask [the ref] Why? Why? I used my experience, I know what I am doing, but he stopped the fight.”
Takam’s promoter Joe DeGuardia added, “[Takam] was alert. You could see in his eyes he was aware of what was going on, and was defending himself. While certainly a factor, it’s not just about whether a fighter is throwing punches back. When you have an experienced veteran fighter like Carlos, who is clearly winning an important heavyweight fight, it’s important to get it right.
“The referee must also know who is in that ring, his acumen, experience, basically his ring generalship. These are things that must be taken into consideration in order to make the right call. Unfortunately for Carlos tonight, we believe the wrong decision was made and that he was alert and defending himself while waiting to launch his counter-attack at the right precise moment. We think a rematch is warranted.”
OH’ Please!!
Summing it up, your comment is spot on!
Takam had his moments in the fight landing a few lead right hands. However, make no mistake, in round six, Joyce’s short left hook on the inside stunned Takam and set up the heavy barrage of punches landed by Joyce. Could have the ref gave Takam a standing 8 first? Yes, but I do feel Takam was on his way out regardless of the situation. Takam fights more like a cruiserweight with his power and size.
Standing eight count is needed in boxing again. Sorts out things like this. Not a bad stoppage imo. Takam would not have lasted the next round and would just have been more damaged the longer he lasted.
Do not agree. first, it allows a boxer who is in big trouble to yes, clear his head, but possibly face more damage that is life altering.
I always remember a fight back in the 70’s. In the last round of a Ernie Shavers match. Shavers looked like he was ready to go. the ref stopped what looked like a stoppage win, but gave the standing 8, the other boxer, can’t remember his name, thought he had won, and that just took the sails out of him. And he got stopped. I felt bad for that boxer. Same thing happened to Boby Czyz, when he lost the title to Prince Charles Williams, though I though the ref called it a knockdown in that 3rd, but the ropes held Willaims up. After that, Czyz was not the same, winning perhaps one more round, and finally getting stopped.
Standing eight count often prevents KO that is deserved.
Another obvious british stoppage. Saving their fighters from a UD loss.
The referee did the right thing, Takam was getting the shit kicked out of him, he was a punch or two from going to sleep.
I haven’t seen this fight yet. Is this a credible argument or was Takam getting owned? Realistic, non-biased responses please.
He was getting hit, he looked hurt, but his hands were up and he was definitely in a position to defend himself.
It was definitely an early stoppage.
Completely and totally agree. The worst thing about boxing is the early stoppages. It ruins the sport.
There r a lot of “worst things” about boxing. Crooked refs and judges and tv commentators – they had those last night too – r just a few of them.
Agreed.
It was debatable if Takam was ahead, but he fought a good fight. They matched up like a poor mans Foreman vs Frazier. Takam was bobbing and weaving a lot and consistently landing overhand rights to Joyce’s grill, while Joyce slowly plodded forward and managed to land heavy shots of his own. There was nothing controversial about the stoppage. Joyce landed like a 20 punch unanswered flurry that had Takam’s legs buckling and doing the boogaloo. He was on his way out.
it is not debateable whether Takam was ahead: ALL 3 JUDGES HAD HIM WINNING.
@Wow Bert, easy now! I’m sorry, ok? Don’t get your knickers in a knot! I didn’t know all judges had him ahead. I saw the fight and thought otherwise. I’m glad to hear he was ahead, because I was pulling for him, and have always liked him. Regardless of the judges scores, he was on the verge of getting knocked out, and in my opinion, the ref made the right decision. Even the commentaters were saying the ref is going to step in any second, and sure enough, he did. Are you still mad at me?
Kris Pissedofferson: Agree, Takam was seriously on his way out yes. And does not matter if Takam was ahead either, he would just have been hurt more and more with Joyce putting on the pressure.
Takin was ahead on cards, although the was in trouble I do think the stoppage was premature cause their really promoting Joyce
What were the scores??
Joyce was stiff and did not impress. Takam used to do roadwork with Paavo Nurmi.
Lumber , how do you know the legendary name Paavo Nurmi? Are you Finnish?
So? Who cares who he used to do roadwork with. A boxer is only as good as his last fight. Joyce has one of the greatest chins in the sport and an engine that won’t slow down. Takam may have been ahead on score cards at that point, but no way would he have our Joyce out. Let’s face it, Wilder has won most of his fights by knockout and was usually behind on points when he did so.
No way, he lost and that’s that. Joyce in 2! next time.
It’s probably all staged, not too many interesting fights so why not run a rematch and a third or fourth perhaps . Boxing’s a joke these days
Joyce definitely hurt him with the left hook at the beginning of the 6th round, then threw a 25 punch combination that took him about 40 seconds to unload. I’ve seen worse stoppages, but that was a bit premature. Understandable that Takam was pissed, but a rematch would be pointless for Joyce. He’s 35 years old and needs to move forward.
It seems I often agree with you. It was an early stoppage. I also think early stoppages as someone else said it very damaging to the sport. At least with bad judging people can draw their own conclusion and still witness a great fight. Early stoppages often ruin a fight that is just getting interesting. Yes…I have seen worse stoppages..much worse. I also agree that a rematch will not happen. At least not now. I say give Takham a shot at Dubois and Joyce can move on to Chisora or Whyte!
No need for Joyce to give him a rematch. On to bigger and better things. Takam can fight him 10 times and be ahead on the cards but will lose every time. If it went on a bit longer, we would have seen another Foreman KOing Moorer.
Ok, Karen.
i am pretty sure that other than Takam, nobody wants to see this again. and it doesNT seem necessary
Joyce will just be a punchbag for fury/joshua/wilder
Takam should get a rematch outside of England.
The ref was a fraud and should be banned from the sport, slapped across the face, tied to a tree, whipped, and sent to a prison farm in Louisiana for 20 years.
Any rep who robs a boxer like this should get this type of a punishment.
Why stop there? …That’s a mere slap on the wrist for his offense. They should make sure he has a celly that would have his way with him on a nightly basis.
Good point, Kris.
Lock The Ref Up.
Fight was indeed close, I had Joyce by 2 points but could have easily been by 1. However in a heavyweight fight this close anyone could be ahead. I could definitely see a rematch here. Joyce will definitely know what to expect next time, but Takam could also wake Joe up in an upset.
Joyce was getting fatigued and Takam was more than holding his own. It’s not inconceivable that Takam could have pulled this fight out. He was burned of this opportunity by a biased and incompetent referee who probably had bet money on Joyce.
Charlie Barry II: How could Joyce be fatigued if he was doing his normal thing of coming on stronger as the rounds were going by?
Joyce on his way to win but he couldn’t even go 2 rounds with Frank Bruno
Refs should stop a fight if the fighter is being propped up by ropes and getting hit at will and not defending himself, not just when the fighter is taking some punishment. Joyce is clearly backed by the boxing/tv crime bosses.
I thought the referee should’ve given Takam a standing eight count, rather than just waving it off. That was wrong, and for doing that, they should order a rematch.
Absurd strategy by Takam though. Plodding forward head first taking shots without firing back doesn’t help his cause. Also, nothing impressive about Joyce. He towered over Takam, but he gets no leverage on his shots. He’s nothing but an arm-puncher, which has been good enough to beat a bunch of scrubs. Very stiff, mediocre fighter. He unloaded on Takam with multiple light shots. No wonder Takam had no problem plodding forward head first. Takam stumbled back from one of those feather shots, but it looked more like he was off balance than anything.
Just a lackluster fight between two lackluster heavyweights. Joyce will be 36 in September, so time is running out for him. He’s desperate to get a title shot and a chance at some big money, after only 13 fights against scrubs. Maybe he can fight Whyte, Parker, Chisora, or Ruiz next.
Takam took several hard shots to the head without throwing anything back. His legs started to live their own life separated from the brain.
Perhaps the stoppage even saved Takam from brain-injuries. We will never know. I give the referee my support. Either too-early. Or too-late. You know as a referee that you will always get the complaints afterwards.
And it does not matter if Takam was ahead or not. He was on his way out.
It was a good stoppage.
I get where Takam is coming from but surely if he’s as experienced as he claims to be, he has to know he’s rolling the dice of a ref stopping the fight but laying back and just covering up. He’s got a point…I’m sure he could have continued. But if he was totally aware if everything taking place he made a very poor strategic decision.
Rope a dope tactic from the Ali-Foreman fight…..maybe Takam speaks truth,but fights over,move on
The stoppage did feel a bit early but fighters know that if you are not punching back the refs take that as ‘game over’ i.e. I have little sympathy for Takam who was putting up a very good show up to that point. Joyce looks so beatable but only the cream of the division will probably do so.
To me, it seemed Joyce early on was only throwing pitter-pat punches, and very robotic-like. The only time he looked good was when he opened up in the last round, firing away after he got Takam hurt. He seems to have regressed from his fight with Dubois. Yes, Joyce looks to have one of the best chins in the heavyweight division, no doubt. But he needs to work on better defense and work on using power punches more often as well. Takam gave it a good fight, and maybe he deserves a rematch, that ref should have given him at standing 8 count, at least. I can actually see someone like Joseph Parker outpointing Joyce thru the course of a fight, unless he steps up his game.
Tacam is good, however, in that round Joyce took him by surprise!. If the surprise fast hits had come at the end seconds of that round he would have recovered during the break between the rounds. We all saw the hits started from early beginning of the round, it wasn’t easy for him to stand up for the entire 3 minutes. The other thing Tacam should struggle to understand how to fight with boxers who are taller than him Joyce took that advantage!